Structured Products ( incl Minibonds, High & Pinnacle Notes)

[arthur]

Dear fellow forumers

There will be a gathering for holders for the above "bonds" at Hong Lim Park tomorrow.

I am fortunately not a holder of any of the "bonds" but I think it is important that the information of this gathering is being spread as much as possible.

For info, Hongkong "mini-bonds" holders who bought from DBS are able to be compensated under some circumstances. It is important that as Singaporeans, we MUST exercise our rights to be HEARD and not jus being overshadowed.

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Speaker's Corner, Saturday 11 October, 5 - 7 pm
CONFIRMED:
Venue: Speaker's Corner, Hong Lim Green
Date: Saturday 11 October from 5 to 7 pm.
Topic: Petition to Singapore Government on Credit Linked Securities.

Speakers:
1. Tan Kin Lian
2. Leong Sze Hian

As a large crowd is expected, it may not be possible for some investors to hear the speakers. The authority allow a loud hailer to be used, but not a powered loudspeaker. I will keep my speech short and give a handout to people who are not able to hear me.

Signs will be put up for the attendees to meet other investors who have invested in similar products, e.g. Minibond, High Notes, Pinnacle Notes, Jubilee Notes. The main purpose of this event is to show a large gathering of investors.
Posted by Tan Kin Lian at 10:00 PM


http://tankinlian.blogspot.com/2008/09/speakers-corner-saturday-11-october-5-7.htmlEmbedded videos have been disabled.
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[blid2def]

Arthur, thanks for posting this. I'll cross-post this in the Events thread and also sticky this for now until the event's over, so folks who're affected are aware of this.

Cheers

[arthur]

You are welcome.

Unfortunately I only come across this today if not, I would have try my best to spread this article wider.

Personally, I cannot believe DBS the Development Bank of Singapore, would have a preferential treatment towards the Hongkongers than its own people.

Why?

Is it the case of indifferent protest or is there something wrong with our legislation?

What are the Constitutional rights as a Singapore citizens?
I went to arms at 18 yrs old to serve my country only to see my aged love ones being push aside from a "Buyers Beware" statement from our higher authorities.

Please spread this news as much as possible to those who have lost their retirement money on this with ZERO knowledge of financial planning.

All they hoped were some higher returns (5%) than a normal FDs.

What's wrong with this mentality considering the old folks have to take care of themselves with ZERO pensions and only CPFs.
Not every old folks are able to have tons of $$ left in their CPFs after providing more than half their lifetimes to their children, flats and taxes.

[kennynah]

i dont buy sg bonds...mini or maxi....they dont make sense to me...

but...hv a ball at hong lim....and make sure u hv permit...or else .... good luck to you

[sidney]

I think bankers dun realise the "true risk" for derviatives and swaps. They may have product knowledge and always use the same sales pitch and technics, but... I feel bankers although sales driven, have a conscious.. they themselves do not realise the impact, otherwise they also won't sell to retirees, although there are plenty of disclaimers to agrue no financial product is 100% safe.

It is the underlying product which not many people truely understands the real risk. Financial engineering of derviatives is so obscure.

[financecaptain]

I am disappointed with the handling if the case so far by the authorities. Understand that in HK, the regulator has suggested to the selling banks to try to buy back the instruments from the investor. Perhaps at current market value; at least I see a concrete step to resolve the issue. Have not seen anything like this yet in Singapore. To add to insult, our home-grown bank, DBS, has publicly announced certain measures to take care only its HK customers.

So far, if I am not wrong, MAS's official statement is investigating the issue to prevent issues like this to happen again. Hence, I am afraid the final outcome is a couple of beautiful policy statements to constraint such activities in the future and not really helping those that are suffering right now. Poor guys ... not a lot of money perhaps to the financial institutions or the authorities, but it is their life savings. Imgaine losing your life savings overnight just when you thought that you have adequately provided for your retirement.

Forget about the complex technical issues of derivatives. Fundamental issue is how can you sell derivative products as a good substitute for banks' fixed deposits ? The tagetted customers of the minibonds are actually your average fixed-deposit customers !!!

[financecaptain]

Basically a con job. It is not even a corporate bond. Like calling a donkey a horse.

http://www.atimes.com/atimes/China_Busi ... 7Cb01.html

"First, the mini-bonds were misnamed, giving the appearance of being a relatively safe bet. As it turned out, however, these so-called bonds, advertised as "low-risk" at many of the 21 licensed banks that sold them, were actually complexly structured, high-risk, credit-linked notes, which are in fact high-risk credit derivative products based on gambling-like credit default swaps. These derivatives are so complicated that even some local financial experts have difficulty understanding and explaining how they work.

Yet such products were sold in Hong Kong in the name of "bonds", with the adjective "mini" being explained as indicating a smaller required minimum investment (HK$50,000) than regular bonds (normally requiring HK$1 million), making them affordable to many small investors."

[kennynah]

when things are rosy and nice ...."we are singapore....singaporeeeeeeeeaaaaaaannnnnnnnsssssss" (song)

when things go wrong...."singaporeans are for free....foreigners are for you and me..." (sing to the "courtesy" jingle)

but of cos...i say.... unless there's really has been a great misrepresentation by the sellers, it's always buyers beware case...

[iam802]

interesting...

if regulator do not impose a fine, the public may think they are not doing their job; hence not protecting the general public.

if banks do not offer some kind of offer, then they have lose the trust of their customers; and I think some customers will open new accounts elsewhere.

Having said that, if I recall correctly, MAS has already highlighted that they can't force the banks to compensate. As a regulator, they can only fine them for breaching whatever guidelines etc.

I don't think the holders of these products will get an answer very quickly. My gut feel, is that the banks will at this moment focus on monitoring the market fallout and asses the situation. Once that is stabilised, and they have a better feel of how bad things are, they will start responding to the various demands and questions from the regulators and customers.

[financecaptain]

I don't think the holders of these products will get an answer very quickly. My gut feel, is that the banks will at this moment focus on monitoring the market fallout and asses the situation. Once that is stabilised, and they have a better feel of how bad things are, they will start responding to the various demands and questions from the regulators and customers.

I hope existing investors would not face with a "LPPL" situation.
If not resolved, given the high tension in HK, investors there may sue the banks and even the regulator.
If that happens, perhaps any positive judgement there could be used here as a precedent.
Both HK and Singapore adopt the common law system inherited from the British.